Zor2k13

@kendo 2   From some pages back about the licensing stuff for each modder...   Dam that sucks lol no way would I desire to make an EULA for each mod I released and nobody else would either that would just suck the fun out of modding completely.

@guk   Second life is full of adult stuff and yes things are different there but adult stuff IS there so it is not going away from skyrim or anything else. People in general like porn and seek it out on a regular basis they just don't like for anyone to know they are doing that at all.       For anyone saying the base game of oblivion/skyrim can stand on its own think again. How many times did the average player go through the game of oblivion or skyrim without mods? I am sure that time is much shorter than the time they spent with mods. Even the basic mods like unofficial patches fixed a lot of things and made it somewhat worth playing again without any other mods. If bugfesta released their next game and NOBODY modded for it for one year not even arthmoor and the other unofficial patch modders, what would the sales figures look like?   Most people that get the next call of dookietime game will play the single player portion only once if that even, they will go straight to the multiplayer where all the real action is and after a while, get bored of it and move on. Games with mods last a lot longer because of mods. Games without mods can you remember playing any of those the same amount as other games with mods?   The idea implied earlier by kendo 2 and others that purposely made buggy games get people interested in modding for them to fix the games gets mods going for that game is exactly right. It is a dam dirty sales tactic and is what has kept bugfesta going at all in recent years. Bugfesta could keep doing this buggy strategy and then lock down the ck for the next game and rake in a bunch of money which is why they pulled this bs in the first place.   People everywhere complained and stopped them for now, but all they will do is try to figure out what exactly it was that got us boiling frogs to jump out of the pot and change that instead of doing the right thing for both them and us. they will simply find the weakpoints in our views and decisions and exploit them to get their way. They know the average consumer is just a dam sheep and won't really boycott anything. The only saving grace we as consumers have is the crap economy making us think more about paying bills right now and less about giving our money to greedy jerks.

I don't think we can ever go back to what we had, I think this argument has been building up for a while now and valve starting a shit storm with it just proves that the shit was ready to fly before they came along. We need some kind of system that both the modders and the mod users are happy with.   Before this happened, the mod users didn't have to worry about anything because mods were free but now they have something to worry about because it looks like valve/bugfesta will only try something else later but the modders have the most to worry about because they have been worried about money for a while now.   If the economy was really good and unemployment was really really low like actually 2% or lower and not fake 9% and higher then NOBODY would even think about money for mods it would not be a thing at all. But since the economy sucks and things are looking bad we are all thinking about money. The modders have been talking about it for a while starting with the donations argument but now the mod users are mad because they too know the economy is bad and see this whole thing as "yet another thing" to pay for and they like anyone else would fight financial increases on themselves every time.   So there needs to be a system that both sides are happy with and soon before valve/bugfesta come up with their own which of course will be bad and won't work. The community must produce the idea of and at least some of the framework for this system don't leave it up to the corps.

Groups of people will always divide when money is introduced, there will always be arguments when even a small amount of money is involved. This community is no different as we can see already. I find the comments about bugfesta purposely making their games buggy interesting because I see that in other places in the world too. For example sports teams that always lose and rarely win. Why does that happen? even after a team hires some overpaid celebrity player that scores what superman would score in every game they still lose?   It is about money and how to get more of it. Losing teams draw in more people from out of town when they play at home and this generates more revenue for ALL companies involved with the stadium at home all the vendors and all parties involved even the tow truck companies that tow away people parked illegally. Also ticket sales increase because the fans of the winner teams think their team is soooo good they can beat anyone so they are willing to buy more out of town tickets and travel more. This makes the owner of the loser team rich and puts them in a better bargaining position with the city where the loser team stadium is built. The owner can advocate for a new stadium later on and get it easily.   Why make a good, dam near perfectly programed game or software when you can make it crap and people will fix it for free? now how to make more money from those people? that is how we got here and it sucks.

Bugfesta has to see that doing the same thing over and over again while expecting better results is bad for business. They can't continue to make a buggy mess anymore it just won't hold up and probably takes longer to make too since they have to fix some of it to develop it to a point of release. Having to fix a LOT of things just to get it to a point of release means a lot of time was wasted and things are not done efficiently at all. Why do other game companies make products that work better than bugfesta games? if the other companies can do it why can't bugfesta do it? surely someone there has brought this up at a meeting somewhere though probably fired afterwards.

They would not care about bugs as we know already. I think a certain level of modding would simply no longer be possible they would herd people to the simple stuff that sells better like armor and weapons stuff. The only access you would get is while using the CK and they would control what an activator looked like it would not be up to modders. Remember DRM is from closed minded security people, creative stuff is from open minded creative people and those two don't ever really get along.

@rylasasin   You are saying the same thing I posted way back in the beginning of the other thread, the crash of the gaming industry in the 80's and so on but it is not so easy to write off creativity as expensive.   Creativity has value because only humans can be creative, robots can't do that and AI can't do that yet. People are creative and creative people are valuable but the industry has been more and more stomping all over creative people salaries for a long time now. Just look at the ad industry it takes a lot of creativity to make all those things that came out of the ad industry over the last what, 80 years? norman rockwell comes to mind and funny superbowl commercials don't make themselves.   Creative people are rare because not even all humans can be really creative only some more like a few. There are only so many geniuses in the world, there was only one einstein only one tesla.   I can guarantee you though that if AI could mimic creativity even a little it would be used to try and replace creativity in the business. Already there is AI writing news articles a LOT of them actually and if you didn't know it you couldn't spot which articles they wrote.   Someday robots will be taking your order at mcdonalds and cooking your food too so work in the future will be about thinking and creativity and anything related to it not manual labor. Technology will take over everything at some point. @sinuev2   Bugfesta would sacrifice that functionality to encrypt/lock down everything it has happened in the past with other companies it will happen again. They could get the CK to read from authorized BSA files so the content could be viewed in the CK but not extracted to disk by it so you can select something in a menu or look at something but no way it will come out of there. Modding will suffer so they can protect the business model.   We already know they don't really care if their games don't work well so what else would they do?

@sinuev2   BSA could be mandatory and encrypted no more loose files to easily rip and that could be implemented into the CSE/CK.   @aydoo   Bugfesta doesn't allow anything so simply, they know if they cut off modding it would do them in because they don't want to spend the money to make a really good, bug free game. Spending money like that to them is a loss when they know the customers will fix it for them for free. They are just smart enough to see that I think, the rest they think like the M@fI@@ as usual.

Witcher series where there is no 1st person camera, can't change your character in any way and kind of boring. Witcher 3 videos I have seen look like mmo interface with some text above character heads and stuff like ESO no thanks.

@arethiel   It doesn't matter what news channel covers it what matters is that it is happening. This shit could be in your town next who knows? People are pissed and extreme groups are making a move read the news it is the same everywhere now about what those groups are publicly stating that several gangs have agreed to work together to kill cops together! Here comes the big shit to hit the fan it will be really bad.

While we were all busy arguing over mods for sale on the internet, people who live in reality outside of the internet were busy fighting the police and each other: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/04/27/gangs-vow-to-target-police-as-baltiomore-protests-spread/   People in baltimore maryland are going nuts! burning down buildings and looting malls they have spread across many miles this is not just one cvs store anymore. The situation is worse now that it is night time there and a big fire is raging on tv it looks really bad.   This is proof that people have lost confidence in govt, the authorities, and the economy. It won't be long now before something similar happens somewhere else. For once I am glad I live in a crappy area nobody cares about instead of a downtown kind of area or a nice neighborhood.

That is what I am talking about the community is permanently harmed by this, now some of the community might advocate for replacing skyui with something else developed by someone "trustworthy" so this doesn't happen again like it won't lol. People are pissed and now they are gonna be pissed at certain others. This might also make people stop playing beth games for a while as in years. Mods won't be made that might have been and community activity might decrease. Even evil nexus will see a drop in activity and loss in ad revenue. This whole thing was really stupid it will cost everyone money and community and those things won't come back to some extent they are gone forever now.

Well the battle is over and nobody really won. Valve and beth failed to do anything properly before they started all this and the community is permanently harmed by the whole thing. This has all been lose lose for everyone. This also proves what I have suspected for a long time now, there are no more genuine, smart and well rounded people in corporations only cut throat dummies that just want to keep their jobs. Corporations are failing from within, there used to be smart people in the work force that would have figured this stuff out and did it right the first time but not anymore.   Real value can be assigned to creativity and making new or somewhat new things. Modern technology will replace labor and repetitive tasks but people are not robots and robots don't get paid! so in order to make any real "growth" as a company these execs need to realize the obvious and find ways to promote and monetize creativity in a way that everyone can agree on before it is too late. Non essential industries don't last long in a bad economy and they know it but they do dumb things anyway which doesn't make any sense.   These are some telling times we are living in.     I think ultimately valve and beth caved on this because they are now in a defensive mode worried about sales of the next beth games. They know their customers are right about how buggy and badly made their past games are and what if the next game is badly made too? or what if the next game is some shitty off the wall idea that doesn't fly like super zombie meat nazis wolfenstein edition or something stupid like that?   I bet that is what they plan to release, some shitty new ip that nobody wants because the demand for a modern, new fallout or skyrim is so great and modders are chomping at the bit to make total conversions of past games into this modern engine, they don't want to see some "other" game right now.   Yeah I bet they are gonna gamble on some new ip that should have been released later instead of now so they are worried about lost sales. They know people are sheep and will buy the next fallout or skyrim but they don't know what people will do with a new ip.

Yep thats what I was afraid of ok then, maybe I can run the female mark meshes from lovers bitch quest in PSE through gerra6 converter and see if it can make them fit the male models. I think I have tried something similar before and it worked so gonna give that a try thanks for the info.

Ok I have a solution for all this...   Modders should sell models already setup for oblivion/skyrim etc aka in nif file format with the needed textures and animations and voice overs setup for followers or quests like generic dialogue voices, nothing in depth just simple depending on the quest or follower. Sell these things on their own pages or on steam with general permissions about restricting their use to only oblivion/skyrim etc but they are not already a mod! these are resources that could be made part of any mod as long as credit is given. Don't allow paid mods instead allow paid resources except really big mods like if zaz, ichabod and some of those total conversion people got together and made something! would love to see that:-)   When big modders do this, everyone will know who made what and if the scum bags on the other side of the world want to upload someone else work it would be obvious they were stolen and taken down right away. This way works good also because it encourages modding more among people that can't make models/textures/voice overs which is the majority of the modding scene.   Not everyone has to make paid resources some things could be free to use only with oblivion/skyrim etc just up to the modder.

Ok I am trying to get a different skin texture to show up for a different mesh during enslavement. The mesh works fine I have the upper and lower body meshes replaced with something that represents enslaved status, in fact I have two different levels of that working now! But the problem is the skin texture is still the same as the regular skin instead of using the different textures I assigned from a different folder even with a different name it doesn't work always goes back to normal skin? If I named the "skin" item something else in the nif file I am sure that the relevant skin colors would not work anymore so that won't work.   I am trying to leave a slaver mark on the enslaved player if they are bought by the slave trader that is why I need to change the skin texture but I don't think it will work this way. I could try those mesh files that are a part of the dog sex quest in PSE but there is no mark mesh for males. What I am thinking is I need to use the mark meshes as part of the enslaved upper body mesh so they don't disappear during sex using LAPF. I have the enslaved upper body mesh and enslaved lower body meshes set to non playable so they don't get removed by LAPF but the enslaved lower body mesh does get removed during sex which is fine and this makes me think to stick those mark meshes to the upper file. I just need to know is the skin method not going to work?

Ok I have the permissions stuff organized here.   Free permissions given but require credits in readme and elsewhere   Alir   Apachii   Bisca   DFSL   Korana   R18PN   Speedbuster   Tona     Permissions I dunno???   Growlf     EDIT2   Ok neo said nope cuz seksy stuff no likey so I have to find some replacement stuff for whatever I was using from neo now:-(

Lovers slave trader final for oblivion?     Whooops! wrong game lol.

What if all this is just some dam marketing experiment? They just need data and have no intention of doing anything long term even with the data? Just some bs metric they can throw around during bargaining discussions with other companies trying to get on steam?   Maybe this is an ongoing argument between valve and bugfesta? Maybe beth trying to throw their weight around and valve saying "see we told you so and your not that big after all so cough up more money for continued steam sales" maybe this is all a bargaining argument for FO4 next es game on steam?   We are victims of greedy people arguments like george burns making a bet with smithers or those two stock market guys from that eddie murphy movie?

Ultimately, most people are sheep and just don't give a dam anymore. People have seen so much corruption go unpunished they just don't care if any new corruption is found anymore. They don't expect anyone to do anything about it so why should they do anything about it? I don't think any society in the world right now will get rid of the sheep mentality.

DAMMIT!   So they were planning this for a long time. Hey wasn't 2012 the same year of the game jam thing from bugfesta?

Hmm... gonna search for that since I do use ff thanks for that.

I need to contact this modder for permission to use stuff from their mods in an edit of a mod I am making and so far it does not look good.   Their blog page has no email section, it is in korean I dunno where it would be and google translate doesn't help much with that.   The modder is on nexus and looking at one of his mods he recently posted this comment at the top of the comments section there for the witch armor by neo cbbe mod: "Steam and Bethesda.... seriously? I'm considering block or remove all my mods."     Someone have experience with this modder and permissions? I searched the search tool here on LL for the author and got no results so they were never around here?

Good, more people will be pissed at gabe then:-)

Yeah, gonna have to jump through hoops for that one. Don't know if proxies work on nexus or not. Most boards hosted in the uk are run by snoberators that block all proxies somehow. Just thought if someone has dealt with this modder before they can tell me if permission was given or not and what that modder stance is on porn mods using his stuff.